2009/02/10

Intelligent Investing Transcript with Jeremy Grantham interviewed by Steve Forbes

An awesome friend send me this interview transcript with Jeremy Grantham at forbes.com.

Who is Jeremy Grantham?

Here is a brief description from Wikipedia.

Jeremy Grantham is the Chairman of the Board of Grantham Mayo Van Otterloo, an American investor well known among institutional investors, but relatively unknown to retail investors. He is regarded as a highly knowledgeable investor in various stock bond and commodity markets. Grantham started one of the world's first index funds in the early 1970s and currently manages approximately $120 billion US.

Mr. Grantham is well known as a great skeptic and holds a bearish view on the market since 1999. He is beginning to add equity position because he sees the market being cheapest in 20 years, speaking on a relatively basis. He believes the market is cheap, but not "very cheap" as it did in 1982 or 1974.

Jeremy Grantham Yes, I would say two-to-one, by the way, my instinct plus looking at the history books, that it will go to a new low [in 2009]. So this is the problem; we're underweighted still. In an ordinary asset allocation account that has 65% in equities, we have moved up to 55%. So, we're still underweight, even though they're cheaper than they've been, and they're reasonably cheap.

Now what happens? If we throw in the client's money and it goes down, indeed, as I think it will [in 2009], they will complain quite bitterly that we weren't very smart. We thought it was going down, and yet we threw their money in. So that's one kind of regret. And the other kind of regret is that we hang back and the market runs away, the one-in-three comes up and they say, "You told us the market was cheap. You told us that you had these 9% or 10% real return opportunities, and you're still underweight and the market's back up 200 points. You're an idiot."

So, there's no way you can avoid some regret. You have to look at your own personal balance sheet. How much pain can you stand? If you absolutely can't stand a 20% hit, you'd better carry quite a lot of cash, because you're quite likely to get it. If, on the other hand, you're made of steel, you can concentrate on the seven-year horizon and filter money in, and having a lot of cash here is probably a bit dangerous from the other point of view.

But in any case, it's a very personal judgment of risk avoidance and how tough you are under stress. The worst situation that will befall probably quite a lot of people is that they exaggerate their toughness. The market goes down 30% from here to 600 and they panic, dump their stocks and never get back. And that's the worst outcome.


He also made some interesting comments on China and Japan:

Jeremy Grantham It's taken them [Japan] 17 years to lose 78% of their money. This is what I say: That exhibit is called "stock for the very, very long run." Aimed at Jeremy Siegel, if you think that people are machines, then of course you can tuck stocks away and hold them forever. But ordinary human beings don't like to wait 17 years to lose 78% of their money or 28 years to round trip in Japan.

They haven't made a penny in 28 years, including dividends, in real terms. And people have dismissed that, "That's Japan, we're the U.S." And that is, in a way, the most simple minded of logic. Of course, every country is different. But do not think that we can't have terrible times. I sincerely hope we will not, and I don't expect that we will. But you have to consider it a possibility.


And on China:

Jeremy Grantham They have a very small consumer sector, so it's hard to stimulate that. A very large capital spending sector. How low does an interest rate have to get to build another steel mill when there are seven up the road empty, not operating. It's not an easy situation, I think. Direct spending on roads and so on is something that might work.

But can they do it big enough, since they're already doing it at a dramatic level? Can they increase it enough to rev their economy? I don't think so. I think their economy will be very flattish for a while. And that will be a bitter shock to everybody who's learned to depend on them.




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